tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post6303332569027783390..comments2024-01-08T03:21:35.616-05:00Comments on DeKalb County School Watch: Civil Disobediance for Higher Education?Cerebrationhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11161868015604029471noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-68160826465431236172011-06-26T16:16:29.668-04:002011-06-26T16:16:29.668-04:00@ atl: Resurrecting our previous discussion here, ...@ atl: Resurrecting our previous discussion here, on Jefferson's idea that the one great assurance of good public order and honest government lay in a literate citizenry:<br /><br />I just finished reading a lecture entitled "The Theory of Education in the United States", given in 1931 at the Jefferson-founded University of Virginia, by Albert Jay Nock, who had previously written the book "Jefferson".<br /><br />Nock at that time said that "I need not remind you of Mr. Jefferson's passionate faith in this idea, and his insistence upon it in season and out of season. It was in his day a speculative idea, which commanded quite wide consent among thoughtful persons, but which the subsequent test of practice has rather tended to explode."<br /><br />Nock points out that "the mere ability to read raises no extravagant presumptions upon the person who has it. Surely everything depends on what he reads, and upon the purpose that guides him in reading it." He advised us to look at our large literate population and the intellectual interests revealed by the colossal volume of garbage it reads.<br /><br />On the other hand, in countering the idea that everyone is equally educable, Nock pointed out that "Mr. Jefferson's plan was this: Every child in the State should be taught reading, writing and common arithmetic; the old-fashioned primary-school course in the three Rs. Each year the best pupil in each primary school should be sent to the grammar schools, of which there were to be twenty, conveniently located in various parts of the State; they were to be kept there one or two years, and then dismissed, except 'the best genius of the whole,' who should be continued there for the full term of six years. 'By this means,' wrote Mr. Jefferson, 'twenty of the best geniuses shall be raked from the rubbish annually.'"..."But this is not all. At the end of the six years the best ten out of the twenty should be sent to William and Mary College, and the rest turned adrift. Mr. Jefferson's plan appears selective with a vengeance in our eyes, accustomed as they are to the spectacle of immense hordes of inert and ineducable persons slipping effortlessly through our secondary schools, colleges, universities, on ways that seem greased for their special benefit."David Montanéhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03306820541878515647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-24541222855593046472011-04-16T15:30:43.447-04:002011-04-16T15:30:43.447-04:00These are not my words.These are not my words.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-16899189439036203962011-04-16T15:24:18.583-04:002011-04-16T15:24:18.583-04:00UncleUncleKim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-83727819747842689252011-04-16T13:07:29.490-04:002011-04-16T13:07:29.490-04:00Kim -
The interventions and expectations @Atl des...Kim -<br /><br />The interventions and expectations @Atl describes dare not just a result of homogeneous population and relatively high economic status (besides, Massachusetts is not all Harvard and the Vinyard - it's Lowell and Springfield, too).<br /><br />How can you argue that you have to have a richer population to set up interventions for struggling first graders? To offer high level science and math programs? To develop more stringent testing for teachers?<br /><br />This is just best practice. How can we tell our kids "Wait - when we get more money, then we will give you an adequate education."Dekalbparenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16376422781260452873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-42294509364771889812011-04-16T11:27:30.513-04:002011-04-16T11:27:30.513-04:00Atl: we are arguing passed one another with our po...Atl: we are arguing passed one another with our points. The migration of people and companies to Georgia is just a fact. So I'm not sure why your raising that as an issue.<br /><br />The lagging unemployment problem here is precisely because there was such a boom in employment and housing in Atlanta due to that migration. That boom has been followed by an equally exaggerated bust in GA because so much real estate was being built out for the migrating people and businesses that went *POOF* ...<br /><br />So please continue to advocate for reform and improvements in public education in DeKalb and Georgia but do not mistake cause for coincidence. Georgia's unemployment rate is not due to a lack of highly skilled workers.<br /><br />The fact that I am pointing out MA <> GA is not to take issue with your suggestions for GA public education. I am simply pointing out that the results may or may not be a direct result of what you are suggesting and I don't assume that it is.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01855554437157990110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-45856327621052060332011-04-15T23:05:35.587-04:002011-04-15T23:05:35.587-04:00@ Kim Glock
One of the most telling figures in Ge...@ Kim Glock<br /><br />One of the most telling figures in Georgia to me is the fact that Georgia is one of the three states that has consistently had the highest percentage of unemployed in the U.S. (per AJC article today). <br /><br />If we had a highly skilled labor force and many high school and college graduates who were proficient in math and science, we would not have this problem. Thus the school system is tied to the economic engine or lack thereof. If we had all those corporate offices moving here you referred to, we would not be one of the 3 states with the most persistent unemployment.<br /><br />I agree that Massachusetts is wealthier than Georgia and has a more homogeneous population. The wealthy aspect has an effect. However, there are many states that do not have the diversity of Massachusetts yet they do not have the student achievement of Massachusetts. <br /> <br /><br />BTW - Mass. has an enormous amount of technical schools. Even small rural areas have technical schools sitting within their high schools. Many towns have technical high schools.<br /><br />Although income and other factors are very important, we have to look at education as the way to get people out of poverty. As a long time educator, I can say that most low income students are the very ones who need the "best practices" Massachusetts is providing.<br /><br />Look again what Massachusetts has done and tell me it is not the "best practices" that our state should be considering:<br /><br />1. High quality teachers who must pass stringent assessments. EVERY Massachusetts teacher must have a Masters within 5 years of being hired.<br /><br />2. Relatively high pay for teachers, and a union that holds the line on excessive class sizes and extra duties that drain the planning time for teachers.<br /><br />3. Early intervention for every child who is not on grade level. Starting in first grade, students who are not on grade level receive double doses of math and reading in small groups with direct instruction by math and reading specialists.<br /><br />4. High expectations in math and science classes in high school. Their regular high school science objectives are on par with the AP science objectives.<br /><br />5. An extensive technical school track for students which includes apprenticeships for electricians, plumbers, and other high skill jobs.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07862880288663811743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-59525790760389617792011-04-15T22:00:23.463-04:002011-04-15T22:00:23.463-04:00Atl, I also have to throw another flag on Georgia ...Atl, I also have to throw another flag on Georgia not attracting companies bcos there is not an educated population or highly skilled work force. What high skills are you saying we lack in our work force? Corporate headquarters are coming here for more than weather and properly fried chicken.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-5615252099324731582011-04-15T21:49:53.172-04:002011-04-15T21:49:53.172-04:00@atl re "pace" ... Mercury must be retro...@atl re "pace" ... Mercury must be retrograde or something because I am not getting my points across well this week ... we certainly should look in classroom expenses but my point was that I think that a voucher system will not necessarily create a "Pace Academy" for every child in America today. I do not think it is as simple as public = bad and private = good.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-63194428403520741012011-04-15T21:39:44.394-04:002011-04-15T21:39:44.394-04:00At the risk of sounding argumentative, I think you...At the risk of sounding argumentative, I think you have both glazed over my point about MA vs GA public education. MA results speak for themselves. My point was that comparing the results from a relatively wealthy population, the relatively homogenous demo, and the relatively higher spending, small state to our relatively poor, larger minority, lower spending and rural, large state doesn't make sense to me.<br /><br />How about NY or PA vs GA?Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-69281372766666576952011-04-14T16:18:31.144-04:002011-04-14T16:18:31.144-04:00atl-- April 14, 2011 1:41 PM
Is it so wrong to l...atl-- April 14, 2011 1:41 PM <br />Is it so wrong to look to a state that has the highest student achievement in the U.S. and ask what they are doing that perhaps Georgia is not doing?<br /><br />Amen to this!!! As an educator in the Dekalb County school system, I've often pondered this same question. Maybe they have sought input, but it sure doesn't show!!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02330598320879411565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-30772707989503089702011-04-14T13:55:30.292-04:002011-04-14T13:55:30.292-04:00@ Kim
"Just ask the parents at Marist, Lovet...@ Kim<br /><br />"Just ask the parents at Marist, Lovett, Westminster, Blessed Trinity, and Woodward, etc if the published tuition rates of $15-25+ represent the total cost of those schools for their children - it doesn't!"<br /><br />As Cere pointed out 30 (in many cases for high schools it's 33 or 34) per class students equates to $300,000 for a classroom of students. Around $65,000 including benefits goes to the teacher who directly instructs the students. <br /><br />The schools you mention have 15 students per classroom (per the Pace Academy website). At $20,000 a year, this equates to $300,000 spent on a classroom of students as well. <br /><br />That's why we need to look at the money that actually makes it into the classrooms.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07862880288663811743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-36042931872895497382011-04-14T13:41:19.685-04:002011-04-14T13:41:19.685-04:00@ Kim
Georgia has not invested in education the wa...@ Kim<br />Georgia has not invested in education the way Massachusetts has. <br /><br />Did you know that in Massachusetts beginning in first grade, children that fall behind in Reading and/or Math are pulled for double doses of Reading and/or Math. Struggling students take Reading and/or Math in a small groups, and then they take the subject with their homeroom. <br /><br />Teacher certification is extremely difficult to obtain. Teachers take the 4 hour MTEL for their subject. The MTEL is more difficult than the Praxis, a national exam Georgia replaced with the easier GACE. <br /><br />Every Massachusetts teacher (from Kindergarten, PE, Physics, etc) must also pass the Communications and Literacy Skills test, a test of critical reading, vocabulary, grammar and a written essay. This is a 4 hour test of reading and written fluency. This is to ensure EVERY teacher is a good critical reader and very fluent writer. <br /><br />They have put their dollars into the classroom and it shows. Taxes are higher in Massachusetts, but all that direct instruction in small groups as well as in the regular education classroom pays off. Equally important is the stringent certification process which only employs teachers who are experts in their subject matter as well as fluent readers and writers. <br /><br />"Is Mass attracting wealthy people because its school system is so awesome or is the school system performance based on the state's demographics?"<br /><br />That's a "which comes first, the chicken or the egg" question? <br /><br />One clear fact that is that as long the public education system in Georgia remains on the bottom of the barrel in student achievement, we will not be attracting industry that brings jobs that require high skill levels. <br /><br />Is it so wrong to look to a state that has the highest student achievement in the U.S. and ask what they are doing that perhaps Georgia is not doing?Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07862880288663811743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-89971235482355660582011-04-14T01:01:14.677-04:002011-04-14T01:01:14.677-04:00atl: "Highly educated and highly skilled peop...atl: "Highly educated and highly skilled people like to live in Massachusetts because they are attracted to the results the school system produces."<br /><br />I have to "throw a flag" on that observation - that is a bit of a circular proposition. Is Mass attracting wealthy people because its school system is so awesome or is the school system performance based on the state's demographics??<br /><br />"Smart," wealthy people tend to raise "smart," wealthy children, right? Nothing against Mass but I think it is unfair to make the contrast with GA in this way. The poverty rates in GA have been higher than those in MASS since before either became a State and before there ever was a public system in either.<br /><br />Less wealthy children are just as capable of learning but I think we generally under-estimate the other complicating factors that come along with poverty rates. People often complain about our public schools becoming too involved in "social" issues. The fact is, our public system educators figured out long ago that they have to deal with these serious issues to get to the education part.<br /><br />So, whether we like it philosophically or not, our public schools are a reflection of who we are and our under-lying problems. And in States like ours, poverty is right at the top of that list of problems.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01855554437157990110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-8702631013230595622011-04-14T00:45:52.722-04:002011-04-14T00:45:52.722-04:00Let's not forget that in Jefferson's time ...Let's not forget that in Jefferson's time there were few institution's offering education TO ANYONE, with or without money. A liberal arts education even at what we call a secondary school level was virtually unknown compared to the scale of our society today.<br /><br />There are over 50 million students in our schools today and less than 11% of them are enrolled in a private school. I would hazard a guess that percentage is not far from what it was in Jefferson's day when ALL education was private and no more than 10% of everyone received an education.<br /><br />So whatever we think of the wisdom of a public system there is no disputing that the public system ALONE has expanded participation and OPPORTUNITY for education among our people.The public system concept is a relatively modern set of institutions so the question I have is what prevented private schools from educating the masses all those centuries? There were no laws preventing private schools from marketing their services to the poor,huddled masses, right?<br /><br />I think the primary answer is clearly money and money remains the primary issue today.<br /><br />While I'd love to have a $5,000 - $10,000 "public voucher" to spend on my son's education at any one of a number of very fine private schools in my area, the fact is that these schools true costs far exceed those levels for parents. Just ask the parents at Marist, Lovett, Westminster, Blessed Trinity, and Woodward, etc if the published tuition rates of $15-25+ represent the total cost of those schools for their children - it doesn't!<br /><br />Ask the board of directors, dean or headmaster of one of those schools how much fund-raising they must pull in above and beyond tuition to maintain and develop the school's plant.<br /><br />So, I think the reality is that the kind of experience and opportunities offered at our area private schools are in no way comparable to that of our public schools and for a reason. That experience cannot be bought at a much lower price whether in a private OR public school.<br /><br />One could argue that releasing public funds to private options SHOULD create options at lower tuition rates and total costs over time for parents. But I think that an honest assessment of this argument would be that the resulting product would be approximately what we get from spending the same dollars via a public system - minus a little extra waste from bureaucracies.<br /><br />I'm not opposed to supporting education, public or private. I do not believe that private is per se better or cheaper option for the "general public's education."<br /><br />That said, our public system in DeKalb is a great recruiting tool for the private school industry and for the vouchers movement.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01855554437157990110noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-53613450244176495742011-04-13T09:57:27.888-04:002011-04-13T09:57:27.888-04:00@ David Montane
Since there is no time travel, wh...@ David Montane<br /><br />Since there is no time travel, what Jefferson would think of today's educational system is really moot. Remember that most people were farmers in Jefferson's day. Comparing the need for the educated populace and skilled labor in our society is quite different. Jefferson espoused literacy from the viewpoint that literate citizens would be more able to participate in and therefore protect the democratic society he and the founding fathers set up. Today we also need literacy so our jobs don't all end up in India and China. So analogies are limited when comparing public education of the present with the past.<br /><br />Clearly, however, Jefferson did not think education of poor children should be left up to charity. <br /><br />IMO - leaving education solely to the states has given up a patchwork whereby some states have good results and some state have poor results - Georgia being one of the poorer. Compare Georgia or any state to Massachusetts. The students in Massachusetts are the only students that can compete on the level of Finland, Singapore, etc. on the International Tests of math, reading and science. Massachusetts is also a state of high taxes and a state with an exceptionally strong teacher's union.<br /><br />Massachusetts has an employment rate that is lower than the national average (versus Georgia which is higher than the national average) and one of the highest per capita incomes in the nation. Highly educated and highly skilled people like to live in Massachusetts because they are attracted to the results the school system produces.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07862880288663811743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-83060255167393063412011-04-13T00:05:46.168-04:002011-04-13T00:05:46.168-04:00@ ATL: Thank you for that history lesson. I didn...@ ATL: Thank you for that history lesson. I didn't realize Thomas Jefferson, whom I also greatly admire, was in favor of education "at common expense".<br /><br />I hope you can appreciate that this new knowledge does not alter the fact that public education is NOT a cornerstone of our country. At best, it means that one of our most important founding fathers, a great thinker, recognized how dependent liberty is on a well-informed populace, and that he thought using tax money to educate children was the answer to sustaining a well-informed populace.<br /><br />The question then becomes, if Thomas Jefferson had the benefit of hindsight that you and I now have, would he still feel that using the government to educate the people - in order to make sure that the government does not take advantage of the people - is a good idea? Or would he now see that this has created a "fox guarding the hen-house" situation?<br /><br />The problem of the poor needing enlightenment is best solved by charity, not extortion. I would like to know if 60% of all state and local taxes in Virginia went toward education in Jefferson's day.<br /><br />Do you think our public education system in the past few generations has created the environment Thomas Jefferson wanted to sustain in which America would continue to have "wise and honest officials"?<br /><br />Interesting point about there never being a Constitutional amendment regarding education, and yet here we are with a US DOE in full control of all the states' educational systems. In a truly free market system, a plethora of approaches toward education would be explored. If the states had remained sovereign, there would at least be 50 competing systems. Now we have this cookie-cutter approach for the whole country. <br /><br />What student wants to be crammed into the same mold as every other student? How can any real learning take place this way?David Montanéhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03306820541878515647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-86597858936385770562011-04-11T02:10:29.002-04:002011-04-11T02:10:29.002-04:00Look, if these folks want an education, great! If...Look, if these folks want an education, great! If you get educated here, you must work here and help pay for others to be educated. You must assimilate into our country and learn English. I don't mind at all if these undocumented or illegals want what we have. However, they should stand in line like my parents did. Get your citizenship and move on with your life.<br /><br />We should look at the rules of other countries and see what they insist on, if you want to become a citizen. Mexico's is very tough. In Mexico, folks that become citizens, and are not from Mexico, can not own property and MUST learn the language along with many other tough steps.<br /><br />I say let's celebrate these kids who are enrolled in our schools. However, when it's time to work you must work here, be taxed here and live here long enough to help pay for others education. Also, if you commit a felony you could be sent home and citizenship revoked.<br /><br />It's time we secure our borders and ask the parents of these kids to work on becoming legal citizens and if they do welcome them with open arms!Atlanta Media Guyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16934015425859698186noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-58763482279085939712011-04-10T12:15:53.830-04:002011-04-10T12:15:53.830-04:00Dekalb parent,
One of the problems for them is a ...Dekalb parent,<br /><br />One of the problems for them is a path to citizenship. Earning a 4 year degree without citizenship, doesn't give them very much potential for future employment.<br /><br />Maryland is looking at a different tact.<br /><br />Go and complete community college and then you are eligible for in state tuition at the 4 year schools.<br /><br />http://www.fredericknewspost.com/sections/news/displayBreaking.htm?StoryID=119573themommyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01829171693817032539noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-4472898558252425642011-04-10T11:53:13.047-04:002011-04-10T11:53:13.047-04:00@Kim -
Thank you for your explanation. I re-read ...@Kim -<br /><br />Thank you for your explanation. I re-read my post, and in an effort to be completely logical, I think I obscured my point. <br /><br />If those students have achieved enough to be admitted to our state's "better" colleges/universities, then it can be assumed they will be as capable of contributing to our society as any other student. What is the problem here? Should we not be judging each person on her/his merits? They're here. They speak our language without an accent (except perhaps a regional Georgia accent). They have a potential to contribute as much to our society as anyone else. What's the problem?Dekalbparenthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16376422781260452873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-25270623681344722942011-04-10T11:31:57.249-04:002011-04-10T11:31:57.249-04:00@ David Montane
"The cornerstone of our count...@ David Montane<br />"The cornerstone of our country is not public education (where did THAT idea come from?)"<br /><br />LOL David - it came from Thomas Jefferson.<br /><br />Thomas Jefferson considered public education to be one of the most essential foundations of our democracy. Remember him? Jefferson wrote the Declaration of Independence, helped write the Constitution of the United States, and was our third President. <br /><br />Jefferson quotes:<br />""If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be."<br /><br />". . . whenever the people are well-informed, they can be trusted with their own government; that, whenever things get so far wrong as to attract their notice, they may be relied on to set them right." <br /><br />Jefferson also said:<br />1. "...that democracy cannot long exist without enlightenment...<br />2. ...that it cannot function without wise and honest officials...<br />3. ...that talent and virtue, needed in a free society, should be educated regardless of wealth, birth or other accidental condition...<br />4. that the children of the poor must be thus educated at common expense."<br /><br />Jefferson felt so strongly about education that he, as a strict constitutional constructionist, submitted to Congress an amendment to the constitution to legalize federal support for education in his State of the Union Address, December 2, 1806. "Education is here placed among the articles of public care. . . " <br /><br />"...Every government degenerates when trusted to the rulers of the people alone. The people themselves are its only safe depositories. And to render even them safe, their minds must be improved to a certain degree. . . . <br />...An amendment to our constitution must here come in aid of the public education. The influence over government must be shared among all people."<br /> <br />The amendment was never considered, so, Jefferson turned his efforts to his state of Virginia. He developed a comprehensive plan for education which encompassed elementary, secondary, and university levels.<br /><br />Thomas Jefferson was one of the greatest thinker the U.S. has ever had in terms of our political philosophy and political system. The idea of liberty for all came directly from Jefferson and he held the idea of public education as a prerequisite to that liberty.Gaylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07862880288663811743noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-56173426322374423152011-04-10T09:39:32.058-04:002011-04-10T09:39:32.058-04:00Well, IMO, this state turned a blind eye for a ver...Well, IMO, this state turned a blind eye for a very long time as well. There is a huge benefit to the agriculture industry to be able to employ hard-working illegal immigrants at low wages. When the state coffers were flush, no one seemed to care how much illegals were costing taxpayers. Now they do. They have to. But to blame it on the illegals themselves is a cop-out. Everyone is complicit in where we are today. To harshly put the blame on one group over another isn't right. But there is no doubt that the healthcare, education and judicial costs of millions of illegal immigrants has gone far beyond what U.S. taxpayers can bear.Cerebrationhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11161868015604029471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-47501567040620610012011-04-10T09:27:10.923-04:002011-04-10T09:27:10.923-04:00Cere
The feds turned a blind eye but the states h...Cere<br /><br />The feds turned a blind eye but the states have to pay the bills. States are required to educated all children, regardless of immigration status, but like the costs associated with special education, the feds come nowhere near covering the actual expenses. <br /><br />This is why so many states are looking at making things much more uncomfortable for immigrants who are not here legally. They can't afford the costs.<br /><br />I haven't had time to study the budget deal, but I understand that the republicans are going to propose big changes to Medicaid. This will also have a huge impact on immigrants, legal and illegal.<br /><br />States will not be able to make up the difference if the feds start funding medicaid less.themommyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01829171693817032539noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-23645371803395045932011-04-09T23:17:56.515-04:002011-04-09T23:17:56.515-04:00Since my own dear father illegally immigrated here...Since my own dear father illegally immigrated here in 1952, became a naturalized citizen in the late '60's, was a successful, hardworking businessman, paid all his taxes as any citizen would, plus paid for my three sisters' and my tuition until we were old enough to pay our own, this subject is very close to me.<br /><br />There is no excuse for government to coercively take money from me in the form of taxes or erode the value of my money by inflating the money supply, and distribute funds to others in the form of welfare. This includes using it to pay for schooling, whether that schooling is K-12 or college, public, charter or voucher, for citizens or immigrants, legal or illegal.<br /><br />The answer to the illegal immigration problem is simple: Re-legalize it! The cornerstone of our country is not public education (where did THAT idea come from?), it is liberty for all! Citizens and immigrants alike have a right to learn, just not at my expense. I want my right to spend my money on my own education returned to me.David Montanéhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03306820541878515647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-11615853944181732242011-04-09T19:55:22.113-04:002011-04-09T19:55:22.113-04:00I just think it's terrible that for decades, o...I just think it's terrible that for decades, our leaders turned a blind eye and basically with a wink and a nod, didn't exactly put a stop to illegal immigration and now - the issue is the hot topic of the legislature! Geeesh. <br /><br />Anyway - it appears that GA legislators are joining the groups in AZ and elsewhere and attempting to put laws into effect that will punish people who have effectively been living here for years. <br /><br /><i>Seeing some parallels to their own struggle, veterans of the civil rights movement from the 1960s have joined the fight against Arizona-style legislation targeting illegal immigration.<br /><br />In Georgia, state lawmakers are poised to vote on two bills that would empower police to investigate the immigration status of certain suspects and punish people caught transporting and harboring illegal immigrants.<br /><br />Such legislation, civil rights activists warn, could bring about the same kind of discrimination and racial profiling African-Americans struggled against decades ago. They have been delivering fiery speeches against House Bill 87 and Senate Bill 40 and marching alongside Hispanic activists in Georgia and in other states in recent months.<br /><br />There is a sharp division among blacks on this issue, however, with some arguing illegal immigrants are taking jobs away from African-American U.S. citizens and burdening public schools and hospitals in black communities.<br /><br />Both immigration bills could come up for votes in the final days of this year’s legislative session in Georgia next week.</i><br /><br />Click the link for the whole report -<br /><br /><a href="http://www.ajc.com/news/georgia-politics-elections/civil-rights-activists-join-904550.html" rel="nofollow">Civil rights activists join fight against immigration bills</a>Cerebrationhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11161868015604029471noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-151096942903989101.post-5678127567113517162011-04-09T19:08:25.590-04:002011-04-09T19:08:25.590-04:00all reasonable questions ....however, the state bo...all reasonable questions ....however, the state board of regents themselves said they were addressing a non-issue in terms of admissions but rather changed the policy under political pressure to do so.<br /><br />As far as how these grads would manage in employment, they do fine in most cases. The e-Verify system from the feds is so terrifying to liberals and conservatives alike, it remains an elective program of the government for employers.Kim Gokcehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11599713243186694545noreply@blogger.com